crossflow block castings and identification

[jewels]

seeing that there is already a thread on pre crossflow blocks

i thought id start one on crossflow based blocks

[jewels]

All crossflows carry same standard bore size
80.978 mm or 3.1881 inch

casting numbers

• 681F 6015

Early model crossflows as found in MK2 cortinas, mk1 &2 escorts and capris
In sizes 1300 and 1600
Also this casting was used in GT models
Early engines had a slightly chambered head

• 711M 6015 (M stands for mexico)

later 1970 castings and had a thicker walls , bigger main caps, larger cam follower and cam lobe area
These engines had a flat head surface

two types in this casting

• 711M 6015 AA 1300 model

• 711M 6015 BA 1600 model (taller deck height)

boring the block

+0.040 inch 81.98 mm yields a capacity of 1638cc
+0.060 inch 82.48 mm yields a capacity of 1658cc
+0.090 inch 83.20 mm yields a capacity of 1688cc

[Pushrod]

Hello Jewels, add these to the 1600 block list.


2737E-6015 (in 1st Mark 2 Cortinas)

681F-6015 (in later Mark 2 Cortinas)

691M-6015 (in 1st series Capris and later Mark 2 Cortinas)

711M-6015 (in later Capris, TC cortinas, Mk 2 Escorts locally) and
the Mark 1 Escort Mexico in UK.

All the 3 early blocks used the 8cc chambered head, as well as the 1st
series Escort 1300GT motor, all other motors (1100,1300,1600) used
flat heads, with several different valve sizes.

All the 1600 motors used 2737E conrods.
All the 3 early 1600 motors used 2737E cranks, the 711m motor used its own crank (711M).

The 2737E and 681F have round main bearing caps.
The 691M and 711M have square main bearing caps.

I also seem to remember the 681F block being used
as a short block in some Lotus Twin Cam Motors ?????.

Prior to the 691m and 711m square mains caps being released,
people fitted machined steel caps to earlier motors, there is no
need with the later caps as they will take 200+ HP.

All 3 early blocks use small stem cam followers.
The 711M block uses the large stem cam follower.

Gary.

[Paul T]

And the AX 831C Motorsport block, which externally is only different on the left side of the block

[garyeanderson]

Seeing Paul open the door on the AX block, I thought I would post some photos of one of the blocks that passed through my hands. I sold it early last year to pay the quarterly house taxes as there was a shortage of funds at the time.

[jewels]

gee that was a bugga gary
having to sell it

got any more ?

[garyeanderson]

Hi Jewels

I had two for a while. The Formula Ford guys were swapping them out for 711 blocks to save 3 or 4 pounds. The first one went to New Zealand and the Second one went to my good friend for his Plus2 1700 twincam project. The only other one I have is in an S4 Elan Coupe, a 1700cc twin cam and its not available at the moment. I wouldn't go out of my way for an 831C AX block with FFRP coming out with there newly redesigned Kent block. If they (Ford) really take the sugestions of everyone to heart and cast up a block that we have been hoping for (86mm max bore at a minimum) then we will all be happy. I have seen at least a half a dozen AX blocks for sale since Ford said that they were going to re-introduce the Kent block. It seems like folks that were hording them now figure they may get stuck holding the AX bag. The Main Cap fit on these AX blocks is not the sweetest but they seem to command top dollar. Maybe Paul will coment some more on this.

http://www.race-cars.com/partbd/messages/19826.htm


Author: covilte January 12, 2010 at 17:38:42 from 41.30.131.85 Hi I have 4 Ford BDA/Twin Cam/Kent 831C engine blocks for sale.
They are all standard.
The price is $1250 per unit,that includes shipping anyware in the US.
Shipping is done thru Fedex.
Please email me for any question and for photos.

Thanks


http://www.race-cars.com/partbd/messages/19801.htm


Author: tiaan January 6, 2010 at 07:06:12 from 196.209.98.212 Hi Guys

I have 5 rare Ford Kent 831C AX blocks with main caps for sale.
3 Blocks are still standard,1 is 20thou and 1 is 40thou.
The price of these blocks are $1800.00 and that includes shipping to anyware in the US.
Shipping will be done through Fedex,door to door in 10-15 days
Shipping can be done to the UK at the same price.

Thanks
Tiaan
+27784838788


Gary

[Paul T]

I think $1250 is about the money with standard bores however until we know what a new block is going to cost it's all speculation.

The new blocks should end up that close to what an AX block is that it would be a re-make rather than a new block, that is if they get right?

As for the cost of a new block I would hope that they will only be around $1000 - $1250, if you can buy a complete long Duratec for approx. $2500 the block is actually expensive at that price, I'm sure they will tell us that the cost is due to low production volumes etc. when it's really a case of we have it you want and this is the price.

Just out of interest in regard to main cap fitment Cosworth took all there blocks to .015" o/s because they didn't like the Ford fitment/finish.

[sevenhead]

If they cast the blocks in compacted graphite iron as reported, Ford will have "justification" for a higher price. The CGI is stronger, sexier and harder to machine.

I read somewhere that the AX blocks were heavier than the 711M? Not true?

Lee

[garyeanderson]

Hi Lee
88 pounds or 40 kilo for the bare AX bare block with main caps and bolts. I don't have a weight for a 711 block, I believe I put some square main caps and bolts with a 1500 (116e) block and it weighed 85 puonds.
I believe I said that it was heavier than the 711 block as that is what the seller told me when I asked why he was selling them. Its been a while since I weighed any blocks so this is all from memory. If you have more recent info lets hear it. I am wrong a lot and I don't have a problem with it, getting old sucks but it beats the hell out of the alternative.

Gary

[sevenhead]

My bad GaryI can blame it on the time (2:00 AM) or a senior moment (no icon for that and I don't want to p/o the blondes). The latter is more likely.
You said that the FF guys were swapping out the AX for the 711M to save a few pounds. My pee brain had it turned around.
All I can contribute is pre-crossflow stuff -
2731 block with steel caps = 81 lbs (37 kg)
Bare GT head = 31 lbs (14 kg)

Cheers
Lee

[grantw]

any more details on the 'new' xflow block that is going to be (or is now) sold through ford racing? or have i gone straight past a comment here already???

[garyeanderson]

The new blocks are not out. They may be out by sometime this summer, which is what I have heard. I E-mailed the project leader (as have others) with their hopes and want's for the new to be released block. From my understanding, Ford Racing is going to try and lower the oil cross feed passage (from the oil pump side to the exhaust side with the main oil gallery) that passed between Cylinders 2 and 3. This is to make it so when the block has a large overbore (greater than 85.5mm) the chances of breaking through the cylinder bore to the oil passage are eliminated. The bores are supposed to be Siamesed and the block casting material is CGI. This is all I have heard and I don't know a price but I would hope (wish?) that its under $1k usd and will allow bores at least to 86mm and hopefully larger, but I doubt that it will be much more. To put enough CGI iron around the bores to go from 81 to more than 86 (to take .100 inch of each side of each cylinder wall is already a lot of meat) will be a tough thing to do and still keep the weight down. I am just a consumer, I don't know the people that are doing the project but as someone that has bought their products before and hope to again I voiced my wish list with them to let them know what I as a customer wanted. If I don't do that then shame on me as I can't complain when I don't get the block I am looking for. If in fact the price is reasonable and they can some how get a block that will bore to nearer to 90 mm then you can bet the price of ALL of those expensive Alloy block will drop like a stone in a barrel. I guess we have to be patient and wait for the out come to see what Ford Racing can deliver.

Gary

[grantw]

lets hope the price is respectable and if we can get large capacity safely... my mate has been looking at an alloy block (he runs a Mk7a Davrian tarmac rally car) but i think if he can go bigger than lighter he might go this option...

[mattward]

Hi , can any one help me identify a cross flow engine from the casting numbers ?

My name is matt (hence the imaginative name) I do not own a cortina but my dad had one when I was about 3 !! So there is a tenuous connection

The engine is I believe a crossflow engine that was fitted in a small fishing boat , the casting number that is on the block reads 691M 6015BA

If anyone can identify what type of crossflow engine this is , or point me in the right direction to where I can find out I would be very grateful

[jewels]

hello and mattward

have you looked in this thread ?

like the above posts ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

it should have ll you need to know

its a 1600 tall deck height

[mattward]

Hello and Thanks

I had read through them but it was all a bit technical for me !!

but from what I gather from reading through again and again as well as lookin at other stuff on the net , it is a 1600 engine from a mkll cortina

would this be correct ?

[robertverhey]

Yes it's the same as my block. Good but not the best.

Google 691M 6015BA and 691M6015BA

It will enlighten, as it did me

Robert

[jewels]

here





.

[garyeanderson]

Hi Matt

Mk2 Cortina or Capri of 1969 or 1970 vintage. About 80 hp in the boat is my guess. Was it an OMC sterndrive or an inboard? What are you trying to figure out? HP or parts or who want one?

In 1971 the 711-6015 engine came along and replaced it, it had better main bearing caps and a bit better crankshaft and maybe the cylinder head was a bit different (depending on the country it was used) but was very similar in power in stock form.

Gary